MathTeacher109 comment-18545 2009-12-02T08:02:20Z 2009-12-02T08:02:20Z While I worked at a South Bay middle school, a student assaulted me by throwing a mechanical pencil into my face. The penalty for a felony assault on one's teacher? The 14 year old got a week off school to play video games, then was back in my classroom giving high fives to the other tough kids. Three students attacked a really nice kid, the 4.0 student son of our librarian, and knocked him unconscious with a rock. Their penalty (for assault, battery, perjury) as also a week off of school. One was actually asked to leave the district since she lived outside it. Should we be shocked when we excuse violence upon violence, give silly meaningless consequences, and do nothing to stop future incidents ... should we be shocked that the kids escalate their outbursts? MathTeacher109 2009-12-02T08:02:20Z advocate comment-16890 2009-11-01T05:39:32Z 2009-11-01T05:39:32Z You are right about not knowing the full story if in fact it is as you stated, but the author did not reveal that in the in the original article. That still does not make egging a harmless little prank. It is unacceptable vandalism which disrespects people's property when done to anyone and the consequences of vandalism are unpredictable as I stated and can be lethal as proved in this case. You are also right that I don't know how the girls were raised. but I have known and worked with thousands of teenagers over the years and you are definitely wrong that guidance makes no difference because teenagers will misbehave anyway. You are also wrong that I'm blaming the victims. I only pointed out the risks and consequences of misbehavior, something everyone should learn if they don't already know. So don't read things into what is not there because that also becomes part of the problem. advocate 2009-11-01T05:39:32Z StarsOnly comment-16889 2009-11-01T04:16:57Z 2009-11-01T04:16:57Z If you would like an idea of what Palmer would have done if the girls had stopped you should look at all the facts of the story. He was in the process of stealing a travel trailer from the court that the girls drove into and stumbled into him in the act. They had no idea what he was doing, threw the egg, the chase started. He was chasing them in a stolen truck, the same truck that he used to chase someone with and run them off the road the week before. So what does common sense say would have happened? Probably wouldn't have been a civil scolding. You espouse understanding the consequence of real world actions. Here's a pretty steadfast rule of survival through all of time: When you're chased; run. I don't know any high school kid who hasn't done things like egging. It's a condition that is always going to be there. As you go further in life, most people learn not to throw eggs at things, or other actions that provoke. But nobody ever learned anything from doing everything right. That kids will do these things is a fact of existence. No matter how much guidance is given it's going to happen. You know nothing about how the girls families raised them. You're a "blame the victim" person. Much more so than the other poster being a supposed apologist for the girls. StarsOnly 2009-11-01T04:16:57Z advocate comment-16881 2009-10-31T17:57:35Z 2009-10-31T17:57:35Z Once again, your attitude of excusing misbehavior and promoting futility of educating young folks as to the consequences of actions which disrespect other's property, as well as how to act to rectify harms they may have caused, contributes to the problem. Read my comment again. I made no suggestions as you misstate. I asked questions "what if' the misbehavior had been followed with civil behavior that they apparently were not taught. I am not suggesting that would have solved the dispute, but might it have? Further, you have no idea unless you were in Palmer's unreasonably angry mind, whether his motive was revenge or not. Neither do you know how he would have responded to three young pretty girls who suddenly became docile and stopped to make amends. You only state your personal opinion of what Palmer would have done. No one knows that but you seem to feel that you are endowed with special knowledge to assert that his or anyone's unknown motivation in such generalized cases is "certainly" revenge. Over and over we do know from experience that when civility is introduced into a hostile situation, the emotions and anger drop dramatically. Let's learn from that instead of defending obvious misbehavior. advocate 2009-10-31T17:57:35Z cardigan comment-16879 2009-10-31T16:43:53Z 2009-10-31T16:43:53Z I, for one, am pretty tired of all the diatribes about the behavior of the girls in the tragic incident related above. Should they have egged the guy's vehicle? No. But that's as far as I can go in agreeing with the poster above. To suggest that the girls should have pulled over when Palmer began chasing them down is utterly naive. If someone is pissed off enough to chase you, it's highly unlikely that they're going to be reasonable if you offer to wash the car. A person who gives chase is not looking for an apology; they're looking for revenge. Palmer certainly was. cardigan 2009-10-31T16:43:53Z advocate comment-16861 2009-10-31T03:52:53Z 2009-10-31T03:52:53Z It seems to me "rage" crimes have increased too.. But maybe we don't have to look much farther for the seeds that sow such anger than: "Who would think that a silly, mischievous prank (egging a car) . . ." While I agree totally that "egging" does not deserve such an angry violent reaction, I don't believe that "egging" is a "silly mischievous prank." It disrespects other people's property, and is a form of vandalism. What happened to the girls was tragic and should never have happened! I'm not defending Palmer because he let his anger get out of control. That is inexcusable and being older, he should have known better. He is now paying the price for that. BUT neither should the girls have thrown the egg or eggs to begin with. What if, after they realized that they had done wrong, they had just stopped their car instead of fleeing. What if he had stopped his car too and came over angrily cursing them. What if, at that time, they had called an apology out the window and offered to wash his car? Wouldn't that have calmed his rage--at least brought down the level? Somewhere in their past they did not learn or their parents did not teach them that every act of misbehavior has a consequence. Nor did they learn that they nor anyone else can never predict the type or extent of that consequence. It is difficult to believe that this is the first time these girls misbehaved. How did they happen to have eggs with them when leaving a party? I doubt that they had just gone to the store for Mommy on the way home from the party. Only the parents know how many prior times they excused their daughters' misbehavior. Any lessons to be learned from this needless tragedy? advocate 2009-10-31T03:52:53Z