Shawn Eldredge comment-32556 2010-07-10T07:57:37Z 2010-07-10T07:57:37Z there is alot of work to this process which you are embarking... and i would be happy to assist, i also think that now that you have mentioned it online it will be interesting to watch it unfold in or on a public forum . you have my numbers & emails introduce your self to Mr Kooyman if you do not already know him Shawn Eldredge 2010-07-10T07:57:37Z Dale Kooyman comment-32436 2010-07-08T20:00:46Z 2010-07-08T20:00:46Z You do not state where you bought your building--totally commercial area or in residential. If residential within 500 feet and In the interest of not losing your life savings, be sure to convey your intent to your new residential neighbors. It will save time and money later. Dale Kooyman 2010-07-08T20:00:46Z OliviaArrows comment-32433 2010-07-08T19:32:14Z 2010-07-08T19:32:14Z Shawn, Thanks for this insightful article. Trisha and I have bought a building and will be expanding our business plan to include a gallery and beer and wine bar. We are right at the onset of this process you have laid out. There have already been so many costs with architectural drawings and there seems to be a fee or requirement every time I turn my head. It is very overwhelming. This is truly our life savings. I know most people have investors, but we are spending our own hard earned money. Going through this I understand why more of us don't open cafes and bars. It is Expensive!! Nevertheless we are on track and we couldn't be more excited! I am going to track you down for advice when needed!!! -Olivia Coelho Bows & Arrows OliviaArrows 2010-07-08T19:32:14Z CCC comment-32300 2010-07-07T16:38:55Z 2010-07-07T16:38:55Z oh dear. well, good luck to them CCC 2010-07-07T16:38:55Z Dale Kooyman comment-32270 2010-07-07T03:02:37Z 2010-07-07T03:02:37Z mtscramento: Keep in mind that issuing an alcohol selling business license (on or off-sale) generates revenue for ABC to fund staffing and their operation. So they have a tight line to walk. Their share of the state's general fund is very small. One or two or even 20 residents who file protests do not cause ABC to deny an alcohol license. ABC reviews conditions requested by residential neighbors and does not accept any that staff considers unenforceable or unreasonable. ABC is the final decider of those conditions and if a licensee agrees to abide by the conditions ABC finalizes, the license is granted. It is also important to remember that obtaining a license to operate an alcohol selling establishment is the only performance license that a state grants without requiring the applicant to pass a knowledge or performance test which demonstrates the applicant knows something about the field in which he/she will be making money. There is no requirement that the applicant possesses the skill to operate such a business and employ individuals who will be dispensing alcohol. As Shawn and any other contractor (general, electrical, plumbing, etc) doctor, cosmetologist, nurse, etc. etc. know, they must pass knowledge or performance tests to show that they have the skill and knowledge to ensure that the public is protected from the unscrupulous. An applicant for alcohol sales does not even have to demonstrate that they know anything about the various kinds of alcohol or the effects of alcohol on their customers. Dale Kooyman 2010-07-07T03:02:37Z Richard Lingensjo comment-32276 2010-07-07T01:35:35Z 2010-07-07T01:35:35Z Google my last name and check-out the website with my picture. Richard Lingensjo 2010-07-07T01:35:35Z William Burg comment-32274 2010-07-07T01:02:51Z 2010-07-07T01:02:51Z It's called "Bulls," their gimmick is a working mechanical bull so I assume it's a western-themed bar/restaurant. William Burg 2010-07-07T01:02:51Z William Burg comment-32273 2010-07-07T01:02:16Z 2010-07-07T01:02:16Z It's actually more common than ABC approves with conditions. It is very rare that a license is denied, even over neighbor opposition. Part of the objective of having a business owner meet with the neighbors in advance is to make clear what kind of business is going in--is it a restaurant that also serves alcohol, a neighborhood bar, a nightclub? If the first thing people know about a new business is an alcohol permit in the window, what information do neighbors have about what is going on inside? William Burg 2010-07-07T01:02:16Z mtsacramento comment-32269 2010-07-06T23:57:19Z 2010-07-06T23:57:19Z Agreed about taking some constructive efforts with the neighborhood at the start. That's interesting to me that the ABC rarely denies a license - I wouldn't have guessed that. So suppose there are one or two neighbors who flat out don't want a place that serves alcohol in their neighborhood - despite the efforts of the owner to address concerns? Is it more common that the permit just gets restricted to the point of the owner possibly giving up on the location? mtsacramento 2010-07-06T23:57:19Z Dale Kooyman comment-32267 2010-07-06T23:14:16Z 2010-07-06T23:14:16Z These are excellent suggestions. ABC codes are administered by the state and very very rarely does ABC deny a license. License conditions are not based on "what might happen." There are hundreds, if not thousands, of cases in and out of the appeals courts over several decades that have set precedence for what alcohol related misbehavior does cause to residential neighbors' property and quality of life when such licenses are granted. Sad fact but true. One thing that would make it all easier and faster for everyone is that the applicant notified neighbors of his/her intent to file for an on-sale alcohol license so he/she could find out their concerns and work together to address those concerns and voluntarily implement controls for inebriates' misbehavior. Typically, however, an alcohol purveyor will maintain that it is not his/her responsibility to deal with their drunken customers once those customers leave their establishment. Therein lies the rub.. Dale Kooyman 2010-07-06T23:14:16Z CCC comment-32252 2010-07-06T19:02:52Z 2010-07-06T19:02:52Z so what is the business going in? CCC 2010-07-06T19:02:52Z mtsacramento comment-32237 2010-07-06T16:04:12Z 2010-07-06T16:04:12Z Interesting article. You make a good point about the ABC restrictions. It's crazy that someone's whole business plan - if it includes alcohol - can be dashed due to these restrictions. It seems like the fair thing to do in this case would be to issuse a temporary ABC permit & see how things pan out. Or have an annual review to see if things remain workable for the neighborhood. It just seems really ridiculous that someone from the neighborhood can block a permit based on what MIGHT happen. I'm sympathetic to a neighborhood's concerns for sure - it just strikes me there could be a fairer way to go about it. mtsacramento 2010-07-06T16:04:12Z cogmeyer comment-32236 2010-07-06T16:00:29Z 2010-07-06T16:00:29Z I too have had very good experiences with Ed Oswald at the DSD desk. He has a sharp engineering mind, and more importantly is willing to think out of the box a bit to help find a way to allow projects to keep moving forward without compromising safety or legal requirements. cogmeyer 2010-07-06T16:00:29Z SACRES comment-32231 2010-07-06T05:45:15Z 2010-07-06T05:45:15Z Nice of you to take the time and compliment city staff! Quite often people see them as obstructionist, however, what they don't see are the benefits that come as a result. We quite often read or see stories on TV about fires where the exiting was not adequate or some building component failed due to the lack of oversight and people die. Yes, the fees are high, it does take some time, but I'm glad they do what they do. On the other hand, what we can not afford is the giveaway program that KerRIDge had going for the benefit of some. It was him & his buddy Billy Boy that gave the folks @ CDD a bad name. Under Gus Vina's leadership the system can only get better and even the counter will become more efficient I'm sure. Thanks again for sharing & keep up the good work! SACRES 2010-07-06T05:45:15Z Marquart comment-32229 2010-07-06T03:16:56Z 2010-07-06T03:16:56Z Great case study! (Required reading for all DSD staff?) Marquart 2010-07-06T03:16:56Z Dale Kooyman comment-32227 2010-07-06T02:04:45Z 2010-07-06T02:04:45Z Shawn, thank you very much for taking the time to write the article. It is excellent. Did I understand that there are still no checklists for anyone to follow? Those were suggested years ago when public meetings were held to obtain public input to improve Planning (now DSD) services. Granted, not everything can be covered by a checklist but a great many can. They are extremely helpful to Planning employees and the applicant. Such lists tell the applicants what is expected to be completed (no hidden surprises or costs) and are a great help to speed up the approval process as well as a training aid for newer employees. But I guess anything so reasonable was asking too much of recently departed management. Dale Kooyman 2010-07-06T02:04:45Z Rhys02 comment-32224 2010-07-06T00:08:46Z 2010-07-06T00:08:46Z i now understand why I see all of these small businesses looking ready to open..but remaining vacant and closed. This is the city's IMPROVED, business friendly approach? No wonder why there are so few locally owned start ups anymore (only national chains can put up with this bull). The city looks at them as cash cows...to be milked until they are dried up. If there is ever a reason to turn out the city council, this story demonstrates why. I am appalled as as citizen of Sacramento, my city is doing everything it can to kill any progress. Rhys02 2010-07-06T00:08:46Z Shawn Eldredge comment-32223 2010-07-05T23:20:26Z 2010-07-05T23:20:26Z i will stop by Sean thanks, i truly enjoy my trade. ( as you may know i made an attempt at running for public office) I have a great passion for assisting small business owners and one of my priorities was to help create a small business advocate department in the city of Sacramento . With the ultimate goal of eliminating the need for a small business owner to not only be a master at his business but a master of maneuvering through the labrynth that is city hall. A check list would be great or an office that could look at your business plan and location then tell you all that would be required to make it happen and the estimated costs associated etc. . DSD does attempt but often seems to be overwhelmed with the particular task in front of them and unaware or unable to see ( or understand) the whole landscape ahead of the human sitting in the chair in front of them . One of the intentions of writing this article ( obviously ia m not a writer) is to bring attention to the stress and difficulty of doing business in our fine city without putting blame on a good group of folks in the DSD Shawn Eldredge 2010-07-05T23:20:26Z Sean Derfield comment-32221 2010-07-05T23:04:55Z 2010-07-05T23:04:55Z Shawn, Great stuff! As the owner of the River City Saloon, I know first hand how frustrating it can be. I did 90% of all work and was at the planning department on a regular basis. They do try to help and my experiences while frustrating at times were great. They need check-off sheets to make it easier on small businesses looking to open so delays don't happen. All in all thumbs up to the city's planning department. Stop bye the saloon and drop a card as we are opening a second location in 2011. PS: Bulls looks great, and is fun , I urge people to check it out. Sean Derfield 2010-07-05T23:04:55Z