Tag Cloud
Tuesday, May 22, 2012
PROP 8 PASSES! (What your neighbors have to say about it.)
by Quothia Wolf, published on November 5, 2008 at 1:49 AM
Storyline: Etcetera...
Loading images
DEAR CALIFORNIA:
BREAKING NEWS - PROP 8 HAS PASSED!!
On November 4th I spent another full day protesting on the corners of Greenback and Sunrise. Screaming, honking, neon signs, carpol tunnel, and all that good stuff. Though as the polls closed at 8pm, I had to find something else to do with my evening.
I heard an announcement on the radio about a Prop 8 party being held at the Hyatt Hotel on L street. Obviously - I was inclined to visit it. The event had a very classy set up, with exotic cheeses and camera crews. The people who attended were overwhelmingly enthusiatic, while watching one of the four giant TVs they had set up in the corners of the room which read the suspenseful poll results. During my visit, I got a few people to give me some of their opinions on PROPOSITION 8.
Jasmine, 16 years old (YES on 8)
"Prop 8 is important to me mainly because of my beliefs in traditional marriage. I am a devout christian and believe that families should infact be started by the marriage between a man and a woman. I believe nothing is being taken away, it's just being kept the same. The innocence of children would be corrupted which in hand would make them question the societies flawed view on marriage."
David, 19 years old (YES on 8)
"I believe in marriage being pure. I have participated in several rallys and done my best in standing to my ground under pressure. I want marriage to be secure and restored. In regards to teaching children about gay marriage in school - I would not like for my children to have that misconception implanted into their minds."
Marlene, 54 years old (NO on 8)
"I haven't participated much in endorcing either side, but was made very aware of the issue once seeing how many people wanted to get married. Domestic partnership just doesn't offer everything that a marriage offers. If prop 8 were to pass, I would be dissapointed in how many people felt negatively about the issue."
Marcie, 35 years old (YES on 8)
"Prop 8 is extremely important to me because it threatens the foundations of a family. To endorce my beliefs I passed out flyers, put up signs, stole signs so I could use them elsewhere, and went to a couple rallys.If prop 8 were not to pass, I would pull my children out of public schools."
Alex, 18 years old (YES on 8)
"I want my kids to be taught about a traditional marriage. I voted YES on prop 8, and went to rallys for 3 days straight. If prop 8 didn't pass, i'd be pissed and start a riot."
Cody, 22 years old (NO on 8)
"I'm straight - NO on h8!"
Bob, 25 years old (YES on 8)
"Prop 8 is about family values, teaching right from wrong, natural from unnatural and allowing religious freedom. Marriage is a religious constitution and if you're not religious, then don't practice it. I posted many ads on craigslist and held some of the biggest signs on Sunrise and Greenback. I hope prop 8 passes, otherwise I would feel that my rights are being trampled and religious freedom is being restricted.
The head speaker concluded the event with a few words...
"Prop 8 has passed, and it's not about descrimination. Gays and lesbians still have rights in the state of California."
Flag Article As:
Conversation Express your views,
debate, and be heard with those in your area closest
to the issue.
Leave a Comment
The No on 8 campaign did make a mistake in not countering the Yes side's focus in the last few weeks on the issue of what children will be taught in schools. Marcos Breton of the Bee made the comment that it's not like middle-school and high school kids today don't already know about that same-sex relationships exist and gay people have been getting married in California for months. It seems to me that some of these parents are afraid that their kids will be more accepting of gays and lesbians getting married than they are. If they don't want their kids to be exposed to accepting ideas about gay relationships or marriage, the parents have the right to pull their kids out of any class they choose to. If Proposition 8 passes and the campaign to get gay marriage legal again is founght, the supports of gay marriage will really have to combat all the arguments their opponents come up with when the time comes.
Thanks for your reporting. I'm glad to find your website.
Marlene
Sacrametno
I'm glad you checked out the site. Yes, the free food was fantastic wasn't it? Haha
I too believe that the chances of gay people going after this law again are extremely high. This prop has drawn insane amounts of attention, though sadly, soooo many of the people are involved don't fully understand the concept of prop 8. (From both parties.) Regardless - this is a an exciting piece of history in the making!
-Q
....just not the same rights as everyone else.
If we're going to define marriage in California based on "tradition", shouldn't we align all our marriage laws with Talmudic or Old Testament law? Should only men be able to initiate divorces? Or perhaps we should lower the marriage age to 13 for boys and 12 for girls. Hmm, that sounds hairy; maybe we should choose a different tradition, one in which dowries are paid and the marriage is not so much a statement of love but an arrangement of strategic importance.
Or perhaps a better solution is to get the State of California out of the marriage business. Instead of trying to find common ground merging religious traditions with civil law, let's have the state only grant civil unions . If marriage is sacred, let's keep the government out of our religion and let marriage be defined in a couple's place of worship, where it can perfectly match whatever they consider "traditional."
I understand your view entiriely, but surely you see their point as well?
Tradition is certainly a word that can be abused, though it seems that many people are concerned about the foundations of our state/country being ripped away. I have heard several people say that if this proposition were solely about marriage, they too would be voting NO. I believe many people voting YES aren't homophobes nor intentionally being discriminatory. I'm from Los Angeles and some of the most liberal people I know are saying YES to 8. It just seems as though everyone's major concern is about the education system, though you're right... by middle school most know about homosexuality.
On that note, listen to this...
A first grader came home with a book titled "My daddy's roomate" which was about a boy with a gay couple. Though there isn't anything wrong with the child reading about it, I have to say that it's a bit wrong to throw things of a sexual content in the face of really young children. At that age - their only concerns should be when Scooby Doo comes on. But obviously that's a really extreme example. Both sides have their radicals!
:)
I personally think that the educational angle of this debate has been exploited. There will always be examples of teachers going beyond the scope of their responsibilities by presenting their personal convictions as official curricula. I believe that this has been used as a scare tactic and has diverted attention from the real issue here, an issue that we need to discuss openly as a state, separate from discussions about the sanctity of our constitution and the role of public eduction. This being the legitimacy of homosexuality in our society. If the government, at either the state or federal level, condones homosexual relationships and family units, then they need to grant them the same rights as heterosexual couples. If not, then they need to strip them of their tax breaks and rights to adopt children. The solution we currently have that affords gay couples some rights and not others may seem like an acceptable compromise to supporters of Prop 8, but it needs to be all or nothing. Anything in between is lip service.
And in any case, speaking hypothetically, wouldn't telling the child of christian parents that his neighbors' gay marriage is acceptable with the passing of prop 8 be as offensive to him as telling the child of gay parents that his family is not if prop 8 failed?
Again, I think the best way to deal with this is to leave marriage to the churches and let the state handle the legal and tax details of civil unions. If we held a congress with all the supporters of Proposition 8 to define marriage once and for all, whose interpretation would we take? The Mormon interpretation, whose members poured millions into this campaign? An Islamic interpretation? How should divorces be handled? Child custody? Either marriage is sacred and traditional or it's not. We shouldn't be able to pick and choose which components of a religious definition of marriage we must incorporate into our laws and which ones we can ignore.
I hope that, if this issue comes up to the voters again in the years to come, we'll be able to speak about the core of the issue, which both sides failed to do in this election.
So, if we change the name of State recognized marriage to "civil union", then everybody has the same status under the law. It would then be up to the individual religions to decide whether same sex marriages were allowed under their tenants. I think that would be more egalitarian.
Thanks Joel for pointing that idea out and thanks Quothia for posting a good article to spawn such a discussion.
On June 16, 2008, California's definition of marriage was changed to "any two persons" by a 4/3 Court decision. Since then, only Massachusetts and Connecticut were Constitutionally required to give Full Faith and Credit to a California marriage. The other 47 were not required to do so. Any State except Massachusetts or Connecticut could have refused to honor any California marriage (including a man/woman marriage).
Now that California voters have passed Proposition 8, the man/woman definition will be written into the State Constitution. All other states must now give Full Faith and Credit to every California marriage (except the ones that were performed between June 16 and November 4). Since Massachusetts and Connecticut define marriage as "any two persons," they must also give Full Faith and Credit to California marriages because a man and a woman are "any two persons."
This is how Proposition 8 has "protected" marriage - by ensuring that all Californians married here must be considered married anywhere.
By no means did i think that you were putting down the article. I don't mind either way. If anything I wanted to thank you for being so involved in this article. It's great to hear your opinions!
-Q
Bummer!....