STORYLINE June 2010 Election

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A flood of money from interest groups is being used to support City Council candidate Angelique Ashby. A committee that is separate from Ashby’s campaign contributed about $36,000 for mailers that advocate for her candidacy, according to election statements.

That amount legally surpasses the contribution totals that citizens and most groups can make to candidate’s campaigns, according to Assistant City Clerk Stephanie Mizuno.

The sum comes from a group with a lengthy name: Independent Expenditure Committee for Jobs and Prosperity / Sponsored by Sacramento Metropolitan Chamber of Commerce Political Action Committee.

Ashby is running for the District 1 City Council seat against incumbent Councilman Ray Tretheway and realtor Efren Guttierrez.

The city’s campaign financing rules are complex. An individual can give no more than $1,500 to a City Council candidate during the span of a primary or general election.

Large political committees are barred by law from giving more than $5,000 to a City Council candidate during those time periods.

But Mizuno explained that groups called “independent expenditure committees” are not covered under the city’s restrictions. The group that provided about $36,000 for mailers supporting Ashby is one of those committees.

“An ‘independent expenditure’ is an expenditure made in connection with a communication (e.g. a billboard, advertisement, mailing) that expressly advocates the nomination, election, or defeat of a clearly identified candidate or the qualification, passage, or defeat of a clearly identified measure,” according to the state’s Fair Political Practices Commission website.

“An independent expenditure is a payment that is not made to — or at the behest of — the affected candidate or committee."

Election statements filed with the city also point out the groups that gave money to the Independent Expenditure Committee for Jobs and Prosperity.

These groups include the Committee for Home Ownership of the North State Building Industry Association and OSE Properties, Inc.

The Committee for Home Ownership of the North State Building Industry Association has also contributed to the Placer County California Republican Assembly Political Action Committee and Friends of Jimmie Yee, the Sacramento County supervisor running for re-election.

Read about mailers supporting Ashby in the election statement from the Independent Expenditure Committee for Jobs and Prosperity. 

Kathleen Haley is a staff reporter for The Sacramento Press.

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edited on  June 4, 2010 | 8:02 PM
So these are the interests that will pull her strings? How is that better or different than the incumbent?
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June 4, 2010 | 11:05 PM
Dale name ONE politician that is not beholding to large campaign contributors.

Please, I am dying to hear.
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June 4, 2010 | 11:11 PM
If by "politician" you mean people running for City Council, I can name a few--Shawn Eldredge, for starters. Most of his campaign war chest has come from small contributors and benefit shows, and matching funds from the city of Sacramento.
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June 5, 2010 | 9:00 AM
Eldridge is NOT a politician, he has not been elected to office.

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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 5:46 PM
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June 4, 2010 | 11:08 PM
The Lefties in this town fall all over themselves to throw money at Republican developers.

Tretheway is owned by Republican developers.

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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:06 PM
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June 6, 2010 | 2:18 PM
Do you work for Capitol Campaigns?
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June 6, 2010 | 4:38 PM
Do you work for Townsend, Raimundo, or Bell, McAndrews?
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:06 PM
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June 4, 2010 | 11:10 PM
Ashby is a union supporting Democrat - too liberal for my liking but much better than that crook Tretheway.
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June 5, 2010 | 6:13 AM
She seems to support conservative 'unions' like those of the cops and fireguys, but has no particularly union association whatsoever, and is NOT endorsed by the Sacramento Labor Council...

So much for her 'union cred'...
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 9:05 AM
The SPOA and the Firefigters union are in virtual lockstep on issues, especially when it comes to taxation and public employee salaries.

Just as the Labor Council is with the public employee unions.

Unions = the Borg, they all think alike and speak the same language - you will be assimilated - oh thats right bbbbmr you are the leader of the Borg arn't you.

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June 5, 2010 | 9:21 AM
As a corporate board member, I have no union -- I'm slave labor...
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June 6, 2010 | 1:10 AM
For what it's worth, SPOA isn't a union, it's a professional association ...
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 10:38 AM
Ok Genious then WHO NEGOTIATES SALARIES FOR THE POLICE?

SPOA = UNION

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June 4, 2010 | 11:12 PM
Hey Hayley I hope you are going to run a piece on Tretheways contributors.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 10:40 AM
Not likely - it appears that Sac Press is verly discreetly trying to influence the election by choice of articles they highlight and what their staff reporters write about.

Why no articles about where Tretheways money is coming from and who is endorsing him?
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June 5, 2010 | 1:16 AM
Ashby doesn't appear to be too much different than Johnson. And that's not a compliment. Heck, Johnson talks of growing up in Oak Park.... but let there be a council session everyday folks will stand around being told to sit down unless you're a "leader" or someone who can support him or his SMI.

Ashby talks about representing the underprivileged in Natomas but where are they? Why aren't they standing with her? Why haven't they endorsed her? Does she even want their endorsements? Or does she, like Johnson, follow the money????? Anyone else can be seen but not heard. If Johnson or Maviglio for that matter, can have this much influence on Ashby prior to her getting in office what the heck, or how the heck will they influence her once in office???? Will the people be out of sight and out of mind???? Will we have to sit down and let the leaders, developers; folks who paid for her campaign or his SMI speak and have their way????
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 1:51 AM
Having read the list of contributors and the amount of money they contribute; I have great concerns...
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:05 PM
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June 5, 2010 | 5:28 AM
I am no 'friend' of Ashby, but LOTS of people earn law degrees but don't practice law. AND many people, even in the press, conflate the degree with membership in the bar...

And frankly, a LOT of people have financial hard times from time to time. That she has experienced an eviction or other financial difficulties makes her 'normal' to me...

On the other hand, she has cozied up the the cops and fireguys and KJ, and supports his SMI, at least to the extent that she believes the city charter is 'antiquated', though I would question just how she believes it's antiquated beyond what she's been spoonfed by KJ's PR and law firm and developer backers...

To that extent, she'd be a DREADFUL incumbent on council -- her character seems one driven by unmerited ambition and local celebrity rather than substance, with every council appearance seeking to blame Ray Tretheway for nearly everything under the sun from Natomas flood issues to world hunger...

Her positioning is just silly, and she has earned my 'snorting and snarling' moniker many times over...

So, while she's had some difficulties, and while some people confuse earning a law degree with bar membership, I believe she would be a godawful council member...
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June 5, 2010 | 12:45 PM
Ok, so this comment was posted in two stories exatly the same word for word.

What gives?
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June 6, 2010 | 10:18 AM
Gits my vot! Shez kewt!
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:05 PM
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June 5, 2010 | 5:30 AM
Please don't vote for him because he's a 'nice guy' and 'plants trees'...

Please vote for him or Mr. Guttierez because they have served their communities honorably and effectively...
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June 5, 2010 | 7:35 AM
typical from certain posters on this site"

"More money from right wing myopes for the piglette to wallow in.... " - i am so glad the democrats only raise money selling lemonade and doing carwashes on every street corner. thank god we have one "clean" party who isn't supported by any special interest groups and unions. whew!!!!

"AND many people, even in the press, conflate the degree with membership in the bar... " - they are called not very good lawyers. its like a heart surgeon, do you really want a "C" student who earned a doctorate working on your arteries?

"Please vote for him or Mr. Guttierez because they have served their communities honorably and effectively..." - i am so glad we have that cleared up now. it is so nice to know that only the people this person supports are honorable and do an effective job. what were we thinking even having someone from an opposing party with an opposing point of view trying to be a public servant. now that we have all of that cleared up, who's ready for lunch?
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:05 PM
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 5:48 PM
Yeah thats right, anyone can get into McGeorge, oh, and come up with the money for tuition (especially try that as a single mother) and pass all the classes to earn a JD...

lol

go give it a shot, if you think it's so easy.

Graduating from McGeorge is quite an accomplishment... almost all of my friends went to law school...some never practiced law. Passing the bar is obviously optional.

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June 6, 2010 | 10:26 PM
Um, among loftier legal circles, McGeorge is known as "McLawSchool', with a very poor bar passage rate... It's perhaps a 4th tier institution among law schools...
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June 5, 2010 | 12:00 PM
Ashby needn't be a lawyer to practice law, and holding an ancient eviction against her as reason to think she is not financially competent is ludicrous. Most human beings have fallen on hard times in their lives at one point or another. If you haven't, good for you, but consider yourself fortunate.

If people should vote for Tretheway or Guiterrez because they have served their communities honorably, Bmr, then a vote for Ashby would also meet your criteria for honorable. She has served her community honorably and tirelessly for almost a decade.. on her own time.. often doing Ray's job for him.

Then again, its seems Ashby's biggest critics don't live in her district and really don't have any direct experience with either her or Ray Tretheway. I happen to have lived in that district for 90% of Ray's tenure and saw Ashby in action on a regular basis. I have a very different outlook then people living downtown or on the south side..

Seems to me like emotions are fueling a lot of the negative sentiments towards Ashby , not experience or facts. I'm still waiting for someone to produce proof Ashby is in Johnson's pocket and represents one of the mere cards he is stacking in his favor on the council. All people seem to have to go is the KJ endorsement (which I would have turned down if I was Ashby). I tend to think the only reason people are criticizing Ashby is because they criticize everything Kevin Johnson is associated with.. which.. again.. I DO understand because the man has done very little to gain people's trust.
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:05 PM
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 5:47 PM
He was similarly obsessed with Heather Fargo, and I believe he was paid by KJ's campaign to bait the discussion about the mayoral race. For want of a better expression, let's just say he plays fast and loose with the reality....
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June 5, 2010 | 4:40 PM
bbbbmer, you need to keep your mouth shut about something you know nothing of.

If you want to accuse someone of something, especially something that could violate laws, you'd better have some damn proof.

I would also be careful not to slander or defame someone online, you might find yourself with a fat lawsuit.
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June 5, 2010 | 5:49 PM
Oh stop threatening me -- bring your damn lawsuit... It just opens the door to discovery about your side and will help the campaign against your candidate...

Make my day, honey....
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:17 PM
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 5:12 PM
Frankly, I don't care if I get bumped anymore -- when people like 'strychine' and 'JoeSacramento' are allowed to just sit there and LIE and post their jibberish, and non-responsive responses to my comments, all in an argot that is more suitable for an insane asylum that for political discourse, all with no sanction whatsoever from editors, so be it.... I just don't care anymore...

I believe JoeSac is dishonest in his claims that he's 'unaffiliated', because I know for a fact that he was paid by KJ's campaign, perhaps through ad bucks for his ridiculous website, enabling plausible deniability... But for me, that's enough of a connection to establish that he is not credible... He's certainly not very articulate, frankly....

There's a considerable amount of bias in this forum and others, including the SNR, which I find particularly appalling because I have been commenting on their blogs for YEARS...

There's something insidious going on in this election and it's bigger than that which has been reported....I believe there is a strategy, a very well orchestrated, organized, and financed strategy... to take over Sacramento government by the largely Republican developer and corporate communities, and KJ is just the beginning.

This I find less than honorable, and even evil to some degree...

And I will fight it in every forum in which this subject matter is discussed....despite censorship of the truth...
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June 5, 2010 | 1:20 PM
Ft. Natomas, I find your response to my comment very defensive. Our candidates at any level are nearly forced to accept large contributions for their campaigns. From the hype I heard about Ashby, she is supposed to be different and strictly grass roots with small private contributors like Eldredge.

The public opposes public funding, so they are put in a bought and sold position. Burg is right, Eldredge is different from others but anyone who runs for office (this his second time) is as politician -- even non candidates can have that label attached to them depending on their attitude and behavior.
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June 5, 2010 | 4:50 PM
First off, Eldridge will never be elected - because he is an independent thinker and has integrity.

Those that are unwilling to take money from special interests will never be elected in this town.

If you have a problem with Ashby's positions on issues, fine and dandy, but to attack her for trying to fund her campaign -the only realistic way there is, is pathetically hypocritical - You support Tretheway - he sold his soul out many many years ago to special interests who contributed to his campaign over the years.

When are you going to start whining about all of the developers, real estate agents and big contractors, unions and other groups that have funneled MILLIONS to Tretheway, through campaign contributions or through the Sacramento Tree Foundation?????
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 5:32 PM
LOL yeah Obama was grassoots - you might want to do some research on that.

How much did he take from BP?

How much did he get from the unions? $100 - 200- 400 MILLION?

The fact that IN ADDITION to NORMAL CORPORATE FUNDRAISING he did a fantastic job using social networks to raise money does not mean that he was a grassroots candidate.

Obama also had THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of hours of FREE airtime AND THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of free articles in print by the liberal media machine.

Grassroots candidates for Council districts in Sacramento, dont get ink or free airtime.

I'm all for public funding of elections - what we have now is not democracy, it is corporate oligarchy that ensures corporate welfare and the screwing of the American tax payer.

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June 5, 2010 | 11:48 PM
Obama wouldn't have won if he hadn't taken corporate cash, as odious as that process is. But if he had not won, we'd have Uncle Fester as president with his sidekick the braindead beauty queen as VP...and those of you who are currently unemployed would not have received your 99 weeks of UEI payments to survive over the past 1.5 years... Now go ridicule Obama for THAT.... What hypocrites!
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June 5, 2010 | 2:38 PM
Bmer, that's it. I've had enough of your attempts to defame me. I am formally requesting you produce proof I was paid by Kevin Johnson (or anyone!) to blog about Heather Fargo or Ray Tretheway, or that you cease and desist immediately. Enough with the lame conspiracy theories and speculation. I am tired of these false accusations and am not going to tolerate them anymore. You are slandering me and I will seek legal remedy if this continues.

If you would like to discuss by telephone, please email me and I will send my number so we can discuss this immediately. Rhonda can give you my email address if you need it. I'm very reasonable and patient, but I won't continue to be slandered and bullied by you. This has gone far enough.

Mark Johnston
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June 5, 2010 | 10:16 PM
Mark, I can't give your address to bbbbmer. I don't even have bbbbmer's email address. We've only conversated on this board.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 4:40 PM
My email address is in my profile and has been there for months... Write away....

Btw, JoeSac, the only thing that would have made your little tantrum funnier is if you stomped your foot and put your hands on your hips.... That's just how ridiculous you sound....LORD you must be a yutz...
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June 5, 2010 | 3:10 PM
The defense rests. For the record Bbbmer has no proof whatsoever to support his accusations. Only vulgarity. This settles it.
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June 5, 2010 | 4:52 PM
He or She or It needs to be 86'd for those comments accusing you - who the hell does that thing think they are.
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:04 PM
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P W
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June 6, 2010 | 5:45 AM
You've "retired" more times than Bret Favre.
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June 5, 2010 | 4:31 PM
PoliticalThinker: Nope, no affiliations whatsoever. Never even allowed anyone to advertise on my site (have turned down many offers btw). Just me and my little opinion. It may seem like I am obsessed with Tretheway lately because I am doing a 21 day countdown of satire leading up to the election. If you were to click on the categories on the right you'll find Ray is not a hot item on my site typically. Here is one category of many: http://www.joesacramento.com/category/consumer-affairs/

I spend no more than about 20 minutes a day on these satirical articles about Ray. When the election is over and Ray is defeated you will probably not see his name on my site again for I will have nothing further to say on the matter. As a previous nine year resident of North Natomas, I am definitely supportive of Ashby unseating him . If I had criticism of Ashby to post, I would post it. But I don't. All I've seen from her is commitment to her community. She's a tireless, passionate, compassionate activist and will make a great council person for D1 IMO.

Also PoliticalThinker: you criticize Ashby for not fighting more low income housing in Natomas. It seems you don't approve of low income housing. Why not?
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June 5, 2010 | 5:46 PM
Believe him at your peril...
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 5:21 PM
PoliticalThinker: your analogy about Tretheway and how he feels about my satire is completely irrelevant. That has no place whatsoever in this conversation. Tretheway is a PUBLIC FIGURE. A politician. It's my constitutional RIGHT to opine about him. My stuff is TAME! Look around you! Are you kidding me?? Ever seen a political cartoon? Here's one for your reference: http://www.seattlepi.com/dayart/20070720/cartoon20070720.gif

Bbbmer on the other hand, is attacking a non public figure in a public forum and making false accusations that are intended to defame me. You can't do that. Not only is it against the policies of this website, it is against the law. I am truly shocked by this person's wrathful comments. It is not only alarming, it is scary. You have no idea what anonymous people like that are capable of . I am now genuinely concerned about my safety after his vile attack on me above. I bet you Tretheway is not worried about his safety based on my zany stuff. I bet Ray thinks I'm harmless. I have nothing against Ray the person, I am only making light of his politics and obvious lack of awareness about what is going on in his district. I would never call him any vulgar or vile names or take my wrath out on him. Never. You are out of line to compare this situation to the satire on my site about Ray.
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June 5, 2010 | 11:41 PM
You are truly delusionally paranoid... You dish out some of the most hate-driven lie-riddled drivel against Tretheway, just as you did against Fargo, and you expect not to have some blowback???

Honey, I get blowback from your folks all the time, and though I'm sure more than a few of them would stoop to threatening my physical safety, and home, and other, I would NEVER do so, and HAVE never done so -- not even here.... So calm yourself, honey -- no one's calling for that...

Nobody has threatened your safety.... just your words and their veracity and your willingness to sell yourself to KJ's and Ashby's tribe... Just where do you derive your fear of physical harm???

Maybe you really ARE an eggshell -- I've heard you were not 'all there', but leaping to this conclusion is truly revelatory...
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June 5, 2010 | 5:41 PM
For the record Sac Press has removed Bbbmer's comment/response to my request that he produce evidence that I was paid by Kevin Johnson to create my website .Not only did he not produce evidence, he referred to me as a "bi***" and invited me to seek legal remedy for slander warning me "you'll be opening yourself up to the discovery process.. and honey be prepared.." which I interpret to mean he will publicly trash me if I seek legal remedy to get him to stop defaming me. But I don't want to sue him. I just want him to stop making false accusations about me.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 4:44 PM
Did you expect me to just accept your threat of litigation as substantive and not fire back??? What world do you live in that you hypocritically lob threats and invective and massive hyperbole, most of which is untrue, at others, and expect people to just accept your ridiculous ranting fiats??? Mars???

No, the SP did NOT remove my comment -- *I* did....and I did so just for the sake of peace... I also amended my statements to include "I believe..." that you were compensated to lambaste Fargo, and now Tretheway... and i do believe that....

I believe you in fact were paid by KJ's camp, and that you may very well be paid NOW by Ashby's camp... And as a quasi public figure before the law, a belief about an issue is a defense to a claim of defamation, especially when you have lobbed outlandish hyperbole against other public figures.

Filing a lawsuit given your flimsy claims is easily defensible -- bring it -- don't just talk about it... But remember that such claims require 'clean hands' -- and the discovery process can reveal much about just how 'clean' your hands really are....

You should learn something about legal process before issuing your empty threats -- you're bound to run into someone who knows what they're doing... and just how impoverished your empty threats are...
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June 5, 2010 | 5:45 PM
PoliticalThinker: what makes you think I don't like to debate sensibly too? I challenge you to find an instance ANYWHERE on the internet where I stated an opinion and either didn't want to intelligently debate it or trashed the person who started it. People disagree with me all the time on my site. Find a single instance where I defamed them. You can't. I don't roll like that. I respect people's opinions 100%, even Ray Tretheway's. But I don't agree with Ray's politics, and I 100% disagree with you that I have somehow defamed Ray Tretheway. You're giving me and my little silly website waaaaaay too much credit. By the way, enough with the anonymous posts. What is your name? My name is Mark. Nice to meet you.
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June 5, 2010 | 5:48 PM
PoliticalThinker: Where do you live? Since you like to debate so much let's go get a cup of coffee and talk about the issues. I'm ALWAYS up for a peaceful debate. Does the 50 corridor work for you? I'[m open Tuesday if you have time. Shoot me your email and phone number via my website and let's connect. I am all for networking.
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June 5, 2010 | 5:50 PM
I am checking out of this conversation now. Gotta finish up some work before shutting it down today

Peace

mj
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June 6, 2010 | 8:19 AM
Yeesh. Anyone else need a cigarette after that?
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June 7, 2010 | 1:54 PM
Several! This is almost better than sex! (Did I say that?)
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:04 PM
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 5:49 PM
Hey "thinker" what district do you live in? For those of us who have suffered for years having Tretheway "represent" us, we know that he MUST go.

The reason you may feel under fire is because those of us that know what he has done are very angry at the thought that there is even a slight possibility that he coluld be re-elected.

I suspect you are working for his campaign, beceuse if you lived in his district for any length of time, you would no that there is no reason to support him. The ONLY people that support Treetheway are public employee unions, Greek Developers, concrete and stucco companies, his family or those working on his campaign.
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June 6, 2010 | 8:16 AM
Thank you PT!

You're right, Tretheway's supporters, or anyone who sees through the political tactics of KJ's crowd, including this Ashby critter, who have lobbed untold thousands of unjust accusations at Heather Fargo, and now, Tretheway, all pretty much lies or variants of lies, blaming them for everything under the sun from flood issues in Natomas they have absolutely no control over, to the economy and whatever else they wish to dish -- along with insults about their physical beings and disabilities, do so ad nauseum, and call it 'satire'....

But when it's done to them, they cry victim, and wimp out in a pathologically passive/aggressive and paranoid manner -- witness the above from one of Ashby's ardent blogisphere wannabes... They just sit there and LIE and then kvetch and whimper when they face even wittier pushback...

Basically KJ's crowd, including this Ashby critter, seem a bunch of professional victims with serious delusions and coached by manipulative jerks like Steve Maviglio, with aid from super scary consultants like Frank Luntz...at least at a distance...

And look what good KJ has done.... but don't hold your breath....
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:03 PM
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 10:05 PM
Ashby has not supported Johnsons SMI, just in case you didn't know already. She also did not endorse him when he ran for office, despite being asked for an endorsement.

The fact that he decided to endorse her means nothing more than he does not want to see Treetheway re-elected. Johnson’s endorsement does not offer any weight to the proposition that IF elected, she would be his puppet. In fact, knowing how independent she is (we have clashed at times) I know that Johnson will not control her.

Personally, I were advising her I would think she should have asked him NOT to endorse her. He is a political liability and will bring few if any votes her way.

The other thing I like is that she does not need the job. She is running only because she has been very involved in our community for many years. There is not ONE other person in our district that has been more active as she has. Her candidacy is a logical progression in her community involvement.
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June 5, 2010 | 11:43 PM
I guess some of Ashby's supporters don't even read her website, OR SacBee articles about her...
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 5:50 PM
BBBBBmmmer's constant need to spread false information confrims that IT is a paid operative for the Union and the Tretheway campaign.

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June 6, 2010 | 8:18 AM
Oh poppycock....

Though I'd LOVE to meet some of these clever union guys, to have a laugh and strategize, I merely support what they do, though I am not among them....

That's just your paranoia acting out again, Forty... They have pills for that, ya know....
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edited on  June 5, 2010 | 10:57 PM
Mark does not get paid to support KJ or Ashby. He, like many of us are passionate about our beliefs. We are all entitled to our beliefs and our opinions. Heck, he comes on strong when he supports someone as would I. Heck I know I come on strong while supporting truth and transparency.

For goodness sake. I just finished reading all the comments, all the back and forth comments. Heck, I don't know what to say, it's like oil and water and the two don't mix. I understand the frustration. Heck, at times I get frustrated also and at times I get downright mad. I really can't believe this went back and forth as it did. What the heck was the purpose? If someone doesn't like me, or says something about me; it is what it is their opinion and I move on. I just don't get this. If someone attacks my character I say what I have to say and again I move on i don't dwell in it; or try and get them to see my point or even like me for that matter. I don't care. It's business not personal. We're adults and everyone doesn't have to like everyone. Heck, everyone doesn't have to say nice things about everyone. It is free speech and many are down right mad at all the games and deceit. Heck, if I was worried about what people would say about me I wouldn't talk about other people, whether they were politicians or not. They are human beings with feelings. And if we can dish it out we have to be able to take it. I talk about other people, I try and do it in truth and heck if I was afraid of being wounded I wouldn't come near a battle. We can't ride in like a knight in shining armor to save the day, people are mad. If we ride in on horseback we might just leave on foot, knocked off a high horse with hurt feelings. Again, people are mad and that anger can cause not-so polite conversation. Being "criticized, attacked or talked about comes with the territory when you stand firm in your beliefs. I just don't get it, we can't be outspoken with tissue paper feelings. But that's my 2 cents.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 9:47 AM
Political thinker: People can agree to disagree and they'll do it with angry tones and not-so polite conversation when mad at things occuring in this campaign. I'm not here to judge community members or tell anyone how they should or should not speak to anyone. I'm not taking sides on personal debates. I'll take sides and discuss the issue.

Yes, I read your comment and I agree, we should talk about the issues. But I can see how we can sometimes get annoyed and take personal shots. We're humans.

I don't sell my vote to the highest bidder either. and tI ake my vote seriously. I also agree regarding Gutierrez. and I agree with your assessment of Ashby and the "it's all about me....."
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June 6, 2010 | 10:33 PM
PT, there is no 'legal matter' between JoeSac and myself -- his crowd are a bunch of right wing losers that stomp their feet when confronted and shout "I'LL SUE YOU!" or other empty threats, knowing nothing of just how complicated doing so is, especially because it opens their own doors to scrutiny...

I would welcome such a filing if only to publicly demonstrate their idiocy and potential collusion with folks in this town who seek to undermine democratic process and embarrass far more honorable people, like Ray Tretheway...

Now THAT would make a VERY interesting summer project, and a reason to be in Sacto during the heat of the season....
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:03 PM
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June 5, 2010 | 11:45 PM
She's not against the SMI -- she believes the city charter is 'antiquated', and KJ's supporting her and counting on her vote to support the SMI -- he wouldn't do so otherwise... and said so....
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June 6, 2010 | 2:12 AM
bbbbmer I agree with what you wrote. He's counting on her vote to support the SMI and wouldn't do it otherwise!!! Johnson does NOT see beyond himself, he could less about Ashby if she couldn't benefit him. Johnson thinks he's still a star he wouldn't see Ashby or any achievements she or others says she's done. He sees himself. His blog public service announcement info commercial towards supporting Ashby was just a strategic move to advance himself and she fell for it hook line and sinker. That's scary!

I have no personal feelings against Ashby I don't dislike the woman I'm not attempting to make her look bad to make Tretheway look good. There are just too many red flags and where their is smoke people better believe there is fire.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 10:44 AM
WARNING THERE ARE TWO PAID TRETHEWAY CAMPAIGN OPERATIVES WORKING THIS BOARD.

BBBBBMR AND POLITICAL THINKER.

TAKE EVERYTHING THEY SAY WITH A TRUCKLOAD OF SALT.
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June 6, 2010 | 8:22 AM
The world can stop spinning now. I just agreed with something Jim said.

Actually, I doubt bbbbmer is a Tretheway operative, but "politicalthinker" is highly suspicious. Like, "oh, hey, I'm a little wet behind the ears here, can you all help me?", not to mention the faux bad grammar, the shifting use of vernacular, and then, OMG! look what I just discovered about Ashby, everybody!!! Lame.
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June 6, 2010 | 10:45 AM
Fort Natomas: Sometimes it seems you can pour salt on injuries, egg stuff on. I disagree with your comment. You know bbbbmer is not a Tretheway Operative working this board. So should we take all that you write with a grain of salt since your comment is not truthful?

Stella, re: political thinker at first I wondered about his motives At first when I read comments I thought deja vous, I was reminded of when I first began reading this site and read Maviglio's comments to aid Johnson. But as I read more I can see how he could very well be a passionate person who supports and believes in Tretheway. Heck, I don't believe Fort Natomas is an Ashby operative and he comes on sometimes even slanting info in favor of who or what he believes in, tearing down the opponent or opposite point of view. It is highly possible political thinker, like many of us, are passionate and concerned for what we believe in. Perhaps he was excited thinking he found something new. I can see Fort Natomas, or some others feeling excited and sharing info they might find important if it was info against their preferred candidate’s opponent. Acrtually he hasn't done much else than I've seen some others do. But then again who knows.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 10:50 AM
bbbbmer: I can understand why you feel as you do. Their are people who rub me the wrong way as well. KJ has become one of them. When we can see through people and don't like what we see well we fight back or speak out. Whether or not it is distasteful is not for me to judge. Do what you do. As you said before you folow your conscious. And your conscious is your guide not the opinion of others... I have no problem with you. You've always reached out to me in the spirit of love. I can see your passion and your heart and to me it outweighs anything else some others may feel.
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June 6, 2010 | 4:00 PM
Rhonda, you truly are an angel walking amongst us...

This is an ugly strategy accompanied by ugly campaigns for ugly purposes brought by ugly people of ill will who can dish it out but can't take it... This in itself is just one indicator of how pathological their desires are...

My hope is that in heaping out my contribution to the blowback against this insidiousness, I can also do it comedically -- I love to laugh, especially at the hypocrisy and hate and bile heaved forth by right wing intenders like KJ (he may be a registered Dem, but he's as Republican as they come, in reality), Ashby, and their supporters, who seek a strategic domination of this city that is anything but healthy for most folks...

Hence we're told to conserve water, in order to sell it to Nestle in a cheap sweet deal engineered by Das Mayor... among other braintrusts...

Let's hope reasonably prudent people counter the cheap and blatant goals of greed shills like KJ and his surrogates, like Ashby, and do so with just a touch of humor -- for they really are kinda funny, in a pathologically ridiculous and hateful way, when it comes down to it....
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:03 PM
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June 6, 2010 | 10:48 AM
I have always said that Tretheway is a likable grandfatherly type of guy...

but that's all a sham.

He is wiley old wolf in a sheep costume.

I liked Kaplan, but she is not in the race.
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:03 PM
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June 6, 2010 | 2:19 AM
politicalthinker you may be my new best friend on here. You are very civil and patient, especially with regards to debating and actually talking about issues instead of ad hominem attacks and pointless bickering that is the norm here. I also like how you cite all your sources and ideas and don't criticize others when they ask about it. I think you should definitely stay on board here as you get it a much need political spark of life!
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June 6, 2010 | 10:52 AM
Cameron I agree with your post to politicalthinker I think he or she also adds value to the conversation.
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:02 PM
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June 6, 2010 | 5:55 PM
political thinker: WOW, I don't know how I missed this comment but I'm glad I went back to read and learn more. I really like and appreciate yoiur above comment. Not to mention I agree whole-heartedly-- lol
Thank you
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:02 PM
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P W
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June 7, 2010 | 8:50 AM
Now he's plagiarizing Murrow. Ithinkimgonnabarf.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 7:42 AM
WARNING THERE ARE AT LEAST TWO PAID TRETHEWAY CAMPAIGN OPERATIVES WORKING THIS BOARD.

BBBBBMR AND POLITICAL THINKER.

TAKE EVERYTHING THEY SAY WITH A TRUCKLOAD OF SALT.
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June 6, 2010 | 9:31 AM
Dear Ben,

I will not participate in your discussion threads again until you either require names or implement a zero tolerance policy regarding abusive comments, AND limit user accounts to one account per IP. We know there are a couple people here who are clearly using more than one identity to post, not to mention the fact that the anonymous Bbbmer continues to call people offensive names that make adult discussion here impossible.

That said, I realize you have a handful of readers who actually condone personal attack in community discussion. These are the same folks who would make the far-fetched comparison of my satirical posts about politicians to Bbbmer's slanderous false accusations about fellow voters. I know I'm not alone when I say people like this Bbbmer person cannot be trusted to join adults in an adult conversation about local politics... at least not as long as he remains anonymous and cannot be held personally accountable for his statements.

That brings me back to your policy here. Citizens should be able to post their open opinions freely about public figures without fear of retaliatory slander by fellow citizens. Any website that allows that sort of destructive attack, is an enabler and part of the problem and not the solution. I call on Sac Press as well as the Sac Bee and SNR to discontinue anonymous commenting and require real names from now on. Many sites across the internet have successfully implemented systems that require, e.g., a Facebook account, phone verification, etc and those same sites do not allow users to have multiple personas. These measures have raised the quality bar on conversations exponentially and their sites are safe havens for people to discuss issues without fear of being harassed or stalked.

Make no mistake, I think Sacramento Press has the potential to be THE virtual Sacramento town hall for folks to come and respectfully discuss the issues, but as long as you continue to allow these thread pirates to sabotage the discussions, it is not going to happen. You need to put a sign on the front of your site: WE RESERVE THE RIGHT TO REFUSE SERVICE TO ANYONE.. and act on it when necessary.

I have started a petition to have all Sacramento media outlets (including yours) discontinue anonymous commenting. I invite everyone to come sign it. http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/stopinternetabuse/

Sincerely,

Mark Johnston
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June 6, 2010 | 10:31 AM
JoeSac, you're wounded and off base. The discussion was rather lively! But the only thing I found mildly offensive about this encyclopedic comment thread was some of bbbbmer's name-calling antics. He/she does go beyond the bounds of decency on a regular basis. But again, he/she is also quite entertaining at times! A regular bbbbmer beat-down by the site moderators probably is needed. Otherwise, where else are you going to get entertainment like this on the Web?
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 11:53 AM
Mark, I can understand why you feel as you do, you're human with feelings and a big heart. But I think you are taking this too far and giving it more weight than it needs to have.

Also, It doesn't mean people actually 'condone personal attacks" But to my knowledge no kids on this site. How are grown people going to tell other grown people how to talk, behave.....? I don't understand why you can't or don't ignore, dismiss.... anyone you feel (or actually does) attack you. It’s just not that serious.

Sometimes people unintentionally keep stuff going. Heck, you could have ended the remarks from coming at you but it seems you played right into it wanting to make friends or prove the person’s opinion of you is wrong. But heck it's an opinion and opinions are like as*holes everybody has one. So what?

Heck, even in this comment where you say you won't comment anymore you invite the person you're talking about to come back swinging. As I tell my son, "don't start cruisin for a bruisin" I don't get it. Everyone is not going to like us, care about us or talk nice about us it is what it is.

Everyone doesn't have to tell their identity. What is the purpose of knowing? What difference does it make? Does it give people leverage to find something on them to fight back? or expose them or find a way not to feel disadvantaged. What?

When I first read your site I had no idea who you were and it didn't bother me if you revealed your identify. You wrote about elected officials anonymously. Heck, it's like when a person quits smoking and suddenly dislikes or criticizes, or wants others to quit smoking. To each it's own. I didn't see anything wrong with you not revealing your name.
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June 6, 2010 | 11:53 AM
Mark, I don't believe in double standards of its okay to talk about elected officials because they’re in the public eye... but community members should be off limits. Well, if we’re on a public forum we’re also in the public eye. But treating elected officials and community members differently is something I don’t agree with. That’s the mentality that makes elected officials, public servants, think they're on a higher playing field, higher standard than community members. I think what's good for the goose (elected officials) is good for the gander (community) Heck, everybody has feelings regardless of if they are called an obscene name or dumb or ignorant or anything else.....

I don't get it what's the difference in someone saying bad things about you anonymously or giving their name? The content is the same. Why does it matter who the person is? Why do we even care to know? It just seems we'd want to know so we can find skeletons or bodies in another’s closet. And then what? Attack on that level? To me whether a person attacks in a civil matter or attacks in a rude matter it is still an attack.

I look for the good to outweigh the bad. There are several reasons I don't speak up if you're attacked 1) we're all adults 2) we can walk away from it, dismiss it, ignore it 3) and the main reason is because I look at the man in the mirror. I TOO attack people. I can't throw a stone at bbbbmer when I live in a glass house and stones can be thrown at me, I can't cast the first stone when I am also guilty. Whether we attack in a nice fashion or rude with obscene remarks; the truth is an attack is still an attack. An often many of us attack another’s point of view or personally.

Heck everyone’s definition of rude may not be the same. Who are we to determine how people should speak. My mother told me as a child; you can’t blame anyone for walking all over you; blame yourself for not getting up and getting out the way.

Whether you see it or not, I could argue you too have attacked bbbmer. Perhaps on a different level and you've extended an olive branch but sometimes we can't expect people to play nice because we're ready or willing to play nice. Sometimes we have to let things work itself out and not expect it to happen when or because we want it to and if it doesn't fit we shouldn't force it; it is what it is for goodness sake.

That's my 2 cents.actually 4 cents
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edited on  June 7, 2010 | 2:37 PM
ROFLMAO!!! Isn't that the same stomping off tantrum we heard from Steve Maviglio???

Four whole replies since 9am this morning.... yowsa... and two of those by Ashby insiders who 'got caught' lying or cheating or bending/breaking campaign rules... groundbreaking...

Oracle, you behave as if this site was your Mecca -- it is not mine. A 'beatdown', whatever that is, isn't going to stop me expressing my views, here or anywhere... and I've dealt with far greater challenges than a little local website... You must live in a very small small world...

This little 'petition' drive reminds me of the line from AUNTIE MAME spoken by local southern girlabouttown (hooker) Sallie Cato MacDougal, when she says, "I'm just gonna HOLDMY BREATH until DAWN TOMORROW"....

And I would reply similarly to Rosalind Russell's infamous response: "Do that, honey...."....
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June 6, 2010 | 9:45 AM
PS: In case you missed my comment on your other article about the discussion forum you will be having with the Bee about charging for content....... I said, "The panel will focus on paywalls and the relationship between the consumer and the news organization." Ben, forget paywalls, what about BARRIERS between you and the consumer? A major barrier can be found in the hate agents on your sites attacking fellow citizens and making adult discussion impossible. Until you address THAT issue, you're never going to build strong relationships with your readers. I have a lot to say on this topic having been a victim of personal slander on your site. I will happy to contribute to any discussion you want to have about it. In my opinion that is the conversation you and the Bee should be having.
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June 6, 2010 | 10:36 AM
To SacPress: Don't let the Bee buy your site! And don't get too cozy with them. The charm and appeal of these modern news platforms is their stark departure from traditional news sites. Once they partner with the old guard or bend to the old school power and money, the charm vanishes and so will the audience.
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June 6, 2010 | 11:53 AM
I already mailed in my VOTE for Efren Gutierrez who has been a long time social activist and is a real genuine humane being. Ashby would of been my second pick but she is new on the scene. I want the weak Treatheway OUT as City Councilman.

My agenda is primarily a humane rights agenda, helping the homeless refugees in Sacramento and other oppressed groups. The big need is for people to stay registered to vote, overcome apathy and get out and VOTE! I am an independent voter. I am not chained to either major political party because both are like a two-headed monster controlled by corporate capitalism. This ain't just rhetoric, it is real.

The point here is for people to be aware of what is happening, conversant about the news and to take an active part in making this a better society, a real democracy, for all of us. I am not into the Left Vs. Right political bi-polar sickness. I encourage people to think for themselves as independent thinkers! ~Che Peta ~ ~ http://twitter.com/Peta_de_Aztlan
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 1:59 PM
Peta de Aztlan?

Gee what is Aztlan Peter?

Just what we need, a council member who supports the fantasy of Aztlan and santuary cities.
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edited on  June 6, 2010 | 4:51 PM
Forty's ideal sanctuary city seems to be derived from Nazi Germany or Mussolini's Italy... Too bad you probably can't afford a time and distance travel ticket and had to settle for Natomas...
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June 6, 2010 | 5:52 PM
The Coup de grâce, a Nazi reference.
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June 7, 2010 | 7:52 AM
Oh, the irony.
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P W
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June 6, 2010 | 3:06 PM
Your "retirement" has outlasted the death scene in the English Patient. 11-hours and counting.
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June 6, 2010 | 10:56 PM
Man, the comments to this story are better than the story itself.

For those who don't want to scroll, here are some choice highlights:

1. When Fort Natomas tried to use the word "genius" in a condescending way but then spelled it "genious." Ingenious!

2. When politicalthinker said he was going to close his account but then kept babbling away for what seemed like ages. Like my mama used to say, "Don't announce, just bounce!"

3. When JoeSacramento threatened bbbmer with a slander lawsuit but was obviously just saying that because he was red faced and weeping.

4. When politicalthinker said that Trethaway being a human being was an opinion. Nah ,pretty sure that's a hard fact---perhaps the only fact in this entire thread.




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June 7, 2010 | 6:33 PM
lol a perfect recap
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:00 PM
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June 7, 2010 | 9:17 AM
She (MB) drinks, ya know...
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P W
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June 7, 2010 | 7:46 AM
Thinker: Step away from the computer.....
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:00 PM
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P W
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June 7, 2010 | 4:28 PM
WAY too geeky for me! I assure you: My identity here (and elsewhere) is singular in nature. And although I do have a healthy ego, I am not inclined to give myself "thumbs up". In fact, I rarely use this particular function, unless I am exceedingly amused, or, in more rare instances, impressed. Keep in mind: Some of us are here more for the entertainment value. Don't take anything personal...from me, or anyone else.
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P W
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June 7, 2010 | 8:23 PM
How 'bout that! I got my three thumbs up already! LOL!
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P W
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June 7, 2010 | 8:30 PM
I do tend to drone on when I'm under the influence of Two-Buck-Chuck. (Merlot, for those of you wishing to bestow a case...or two...my birthday is coming up.)
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June 8, 2010 | 1:20 AM
You might try Fort Ross Pinot Noir Reserve... it's sublime... but it's also about $40/bottle... not exactly 'two buck chuck'... but i know this wine very very well... it's worth every penny....
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P W
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June 8, 2010 | 6:11 AM
Wow! We're planning a day trip up the cost next weekend....I'll make it a point to stop in Fort Ross...assuming that they have a tasting room there? I have to say, though, that the TBChucks I've had (other than the Chardonnay) are actually pretty swell...certainly not swill! I think a couple of them have even won some awards. Never had a headache the next day, either! LOL!
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June 8, 2010 | 12:18 PM
It's truly one of the most magnificent vineyard settings in the world -- and I mean it... Here's their website:

http://www.fortrossvineyard.com/fortross/index.jsp

Really hard to get to, but worth it.....
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edited on  June 8, 2010 | 1:01 PM
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P W
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June 7, 2010 | 9:08 PM
Here's a link you might find useful:
http://www.safca.org/
There is an ongoing, concerted effort happening right now that is improving the levees. You can actually go there and see for yourself the construction that if happening. It took an effort from all levels...local, federal, to make this happen.
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