By Linda Cutler, Chair, Sacramento Metro Chamber Board of Directors The discussion about the new Nestle Waters bottling facility is actually about Sacramento’s commitment to job creation and the process and rules by which businesses come to our city. The Sacramento City Council will consider, Tuesday, Oct. 27, a measure related to this plant that will have a serious and far-reaching impact on the jobs and business climate in Sacramento. We have a set of rules that govern how companies comin... hsilliman Reno 2009-10-29T21:03:46Z 2009-10-29T21:03:46Z

They did follow the rules that were laid out before them, please check your facts. When they applied for the permits the process allowed them to move foward after the city agreed. They still did nothing wrong here. They played by the rules in place. You might not like them or their products however your lies will not change the facts. Sorry!

Reno 2009-10-29T21:03:46Z trapper 2009-10-29T20:42:39Z 2009-10-29T20:42:39Z

Make up your mind Rhonda, you don't respect me but you HAVE to respond to every post I make? How is asking you to back up you’re claim silly? Why let the facts get in the way of a good story like yours Rhonda. Can you tell me why a 4 or 5 of those business you listed above were business friendly with the City? There needs to be a pattern to prove what you’re saying, just listing business names doe's nothing to support your argument. Remember, you were the one who felt the need to say I was wrong so in response I only asked you for proof to back your claim. That's not asking for much from someone as you who claims to be out to learn and understand. BTW, your article you linked to refers to State government in Sacramento not local government in the city, there is a BIG difference.

trapper 2009-10-29T20:42:39Z Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-29T18:21:40Z 2009-10-29T18:21:40Z

Trapper I bet you even give yourself a thumbs up. I don't want to play with you. You're a looky-loo and will only find what you're looking for... But just to close that trap of yours I will play just a while longer; 1) You ask, "Can you give me several examples where the City of Sacramento is big business friendly like you stated above? Let's see, the obvious: Westfield Plaza, Nestle, Township 9, that whole Arco Arena / Maloof fiasco, Thomas Enterprise - Railyard, Delta Shore, and all the many developers, Griffin Industries (Parkbridge Village) , Alleghany Properties Natomas Crossing, Riverwest investments (Greenbriar), Hellmuth, Obata & Kessabrum, Peabody engineering, Tsakopoulous Angelo Valley View Investors, Azusa Project, Area West Engineers, Diamond Estates Verves Green...and the list goes on and on. 2) you state: "It's interesting how asking you to back up your assertions with facts becomes an attack on you" -- No it's interesting you see it that way 3) you state "This is something I'm sure you would also expect from me"-- No, I wouldn't expect it, or ask for it. I don't really value your opinion having read your often times mean-spirited remarks. Trapper, I've written articles (not the opinion pieces you see here) for different papers. I've researched information on articles I wrote and I can back up my statements with facts when and if I feel the need to. Now, you think I am a narcissist, you appear not to value my opinion, you appear to attack me and able to dish it out but not able to accept it. Unlike you, I have no desire and it is not my intention to make myself look good by making you look bad. I will not continue this discussion because I really do care about people and you are making yourself look foolish. Normally I wouldn't respond when I know a question is an attempt at en"trap"ment... LOL Normally, I would dismiss a person by now who I see as not trying to have a civil debate but attempting to caress their own ego but I see a fighter in you and I respect that if nothing else. But since I've learned (and you have not learned it yet) when to hold them, when to fold them, when to walk away and when to run-- I won't respond any further to your comment to me on this subject. I'm walking away from it, dismissing you, I won't look as silly as you are appearing to make yourself look. Have a good day and I wish you peace you seem so angry.

Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-29T18:21:40Z trapper 2009-10-29T15:04:44Z 2009-10-29T15:04:44Z

Yes, back to the story. Can you give me several examples where the City of Sacramento is big business friendly like you stated above? It's interesting how I asking you to back up your assertions with facts becomes an attack on you. This is something I'm sure you would also expect from me.

trapper 2009-10-29T15:04:44Z Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-29T06:31:04Z 2009-10-29T06:31:04Z

whatever trapper.... Silly rabbit tricks are for kids (how's that for catchy phrases- just kiddin.) I try and find humor in situations such as this) But I'm tired of this. I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt. I tried to respect you by commenting to your direct post to me. But you appear not to like my responses. You call me a narcissist......LOL - Nope, just been fighting a long time. I don't care what you call me or how you feel about me AGAIN I don't value your opinion of me. You seem to want me to care how you feel about me. WHY?? Attack me all you want- you are the least of my concerns- whatever floats your boat. I'm not trying to fight with you. And this game is over for me. I'd like to get back to the story at hand but my bet is you feel wounded and a need to continue this discussion. You can play with yourself. I've finished. Have a good day.

Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-29T06:31:04Z trapper 2009-10-29T04:29:17Z 2009-10-29T04:29:17Z

You’re a narcissist, and you defiantly like to hear yourself talk a lot… hahahahaha!!! Also, making assumptions and catchy phrases is what you do best.

trapper 2009-10-29T04:29:17Z Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-29T02:01:00Z 2009-10-29T02:01:00Z

Oh, trapper, you can take note to anything you like. LOL. I don't value your opinion......I did mention I was not knowlegable on this subject but willing to learn to fight a battle I am knowlegable on and interested in....I did mention I was looking towards a bigger picture but I didn't expect you - trapper- to catch that. Thing about you is I think you believe you are knowlegable and therefore closed minded..... That's too bad since you appear to be a fighter. But fighting a person (me) appears where you put your energy verses a cause that too trapper is simple minded... I get the impression you don't like me much. That's okay. I'm not craving your friendship.. From your comments I see 2 things: you are either all bark and no bite or you're barking up the wrong tree. Either way your opinion is of no value to me. But you continuously teach me something that'll I'll need to learn to move the guppies to get to the sharks.... As far as no one commenting on a story I wrote LOL- I don't care. I don't write for approval or disapproval. I'm not like you desparately seeking approval on a site. Is that why you haven't written a story? Are you worried what someone would say? What? You can't take criticism? If I was worried I never would have written it. From criticism can come growth....I'm not afraid of being criticized nor of learning... I didn't previously write that you are simple-minded but this last comment well it's simple...... Now I ,Rhonda Erwin, wish you a good day you can take note of it or you can toss it aside. I'm not trying to trap you trapper, not trying to put you in a net and catch because you are that little fish I'd throw back --you are of no value to me. You appear to think you are all that- but my girl-- I don't. Now you've wasted enough of my time- but it wasn't really a waste- again I learned something from your post........ And oh yeah, you seem to think you are a shark but to me you are one of many guppies I've met while fishing for truth and throwing back deceit.....

Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-29T02:01:00Z trapper 2009-10-28T22:16:46Z 2009-10-28T22:16:46Z

I'll take note that you Rhonda Erwin can't back up statements you post when presenting them as fact. This is the same reason why no one commented on you story last week, it had lots of fluff and lots of words saying the same thing over and over again but vary few facts.

trapper 2009-10-28T22:16:46Z Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-28T05:37:08Z 2009-10-28T05:37:08Z

"...........Apparently, the company did not follow all the rules........." WELL SAID MARION

Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-28T05:37:08Z Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-28T04:35:22Z 2009-10-28T04:35:22Z

Ah trapper I did not write you are simple-minded. I wrote, " that would be the kind of simple-minded thought ---Nestle--- would depend on from a city in deficit.... " I apologize if you felt I was disrespecting you. I merely disagreed with you.. As far as the rest of your comment I have bigger fish to fry and I'm thinking beyond "the city of sacramento" downtown on I street but Sacramento as a whole, politicans in Sacramento as a whole-- and mayor johnson is a politician who is not trustworthy... I'll give you a couple examples I read in a 2007 article on a measure which should go to voters in 2010 on big business influence in Sacramento..... I'm really not trying to debate with you. To be honest I have no desire to present an argument with you. I'm looking at a bigger picture having seen the influence of big business... the prison industry (aka CDRC), education (charter), pirates who high-jacked a criminal justice system.... where Sacramento has been business friendly even to the point where local civil rights organizations will fall to their knees for MONEY from corporations (check cashing/ pay-day loans who donate to their organization) but here's a few examples from a 2007 article (again, I'm looking at a bigger picture since I don't trust our mayor) My comment is really not a reflection of how I feel towards you. I don't know you. If you took it personal- I apologize. It was not my intention.......................I realize the article is on Nestle and the city of sacramento and I had no intention on having this discussion as Councilmember McCarthy stated "it doesn't add up" and usually it has proven in Sacramento politcs and corporations can make bad business and I don't trust our mayor since --as natomas nighthawk stated on another article "the Mayor had not seen (nor anlalyzed the costs and benefits of) the proposal but supported it in July? The problem with the business climate in Sacramento is not the rules, it is the unpredictable and oft contradictory Mayor" Reduce Big Business Control of Sacramento by Richard Holober, Executive Director, Consumer Federation of California April 11th, 2007 Tired of seeing consumer protection laws crushed under a ton of corporate campaign contributions? • Big phone companies gave Sacramento politicians over $20 million since 2000. Result: every effort to protect cell phone customers from deceptive marketing and early termination fees died in the State Assembly. • Banks, credit card companies and other financial interests gave $8.8 million to state politicians in an 18 month period, and buried legislation to protect our financial privacy. • Chevron alone gave $3 million in California political contributions since 2004, and stopped a proposed state windfall oil profits tax. • Health industry related interests, including HMO's, drug companies, and insurers, have given the Governor and his political causes more than $4 million since he first ran for office. Last year, he vetoed legislation that would have established affordable universal health care. These are examples of a bigger problem – domination of Sacramento by corporate interests who fund politicians of both parties. You can read the remainder of the article if you're interested at : http://www.consumerfedofca.org/article.php?id=126

Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-28T04:35:22Z trapper 2009-10-28T02:43:29Z 2009-10-28T02:43:29Z

Can you give me several examples where the City of Sacramento is big business friendly? Oh, and calling me simple minded doe's nothing to support your argument.

trapper 2009-10-28T02:43:29Z Marion Millin 2009-10-28T00:47:02Z 2009-10-28T00:47:02Z

"First, the company followed all the rules, and it did not get any special treatment with respect to the rates it will pay the city for water." Apparently, the company did not follow all the rules, in regard to building permits and rights to work. Nestle may have "applied to the city for the permits and utilities needed," which is not the same thing as receiving them. Has Nestle provided their copies of the documentation yet, to prove they have the right to do what they've already done, let alone continue? Now, you are using the fact that they have rushed to get the project completed (allegedly without proper permitting) as an argument against the public process you are claiming has been followed. That crazy logic may work when the right people are behind the counter at Development Services -- until they get caught and removed. Your comparison to "nearly every business... a restaurant or a widget manufacturer," doesn't apply here. Nestle proposes to use City water, not in production, but AS the PRODUCT. If there are not laws covering this, there should be -- if necessary an emergency order is appropriate. At the very least there should be some public review of the project, not a stealth mission to get it done before anyone notices. The comparison to Coca Cola is a red herring also, since they've been bottling their soft drink here since 1927. Nestle snuck in the back door deal room in 2009, after being rebuffed for four years by the righteous town of McCloud, California. The invitation to Nestle apparently came from the mayor's business team. Are they so unfamiliar with the public process in Sacramento, that they didn't realize citizens fiercely protect our rivers and water rights?

Marion Millin 2009-10-28T00:47:02Z Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-27T23:50:21Z 2009-10-27T23:50:21Z

I disagree with what you wrote, "This first paragraph says it all, who needs rules when a mob can influence the final out come? Who needs more jobs and tax dollars more than this city? Business friendly this city is NOT!". It just seems that would be the kind of simple-minded thought Nestle would depend on from a city in deficit.... This city appears to be BIG business friendly-- It does not appear to be PEOPLE friendly, small business friendly, self reliant.... All that glitters is not gold and Nestle could just be a leprechaun in search of a pot of gold in Sacramento... making far more than what we'll receive...

Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-27T23:50:21Z Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-27T23:34:10Z 2009-10-27T23:34:10Z

Heckasac--- I agree with your post --"Nestle usually faces opposition, so they shop their plant around until they find a city that is gullible enough to let them take a huge quantity of their water practically for free. I'm sure that the towns that have managed to keep Nestle out have not seen other businesses flee the area." Heck-- seems they'd rush to a city (Sacramento) in deficit and appearing desparate for corporation bail-out... promises of jobs (heck they only hired 11 people) so far- and over 2,000 applications... I remember when the city was hiring youth this summer they received over 2,000 applications for youth jobs in less than 2 months- so just because Nestle received a couple thousand applications doesn't mean it's good business-- simply means people need jobs and heck all money isn't good money-- Surely we can't throw caution to the wind. Surely Nestle is looking out for Nestle and not necessarily the common good of Sacramento and surely when Nestle gets what Nestle wants Nestle will leave Sacramento the same way it came- with another agenda than creating jobs for Sacramento.

Rhonda Erwin 2009-10-27T23:34:10Z heckasac 2009-10-27T23:15:24Z 2009-10-27T23:15:24Z

We are not the only city to protest a proposed plant. Most recently, McCloud, California rejected a plant, and Flagstaff did as well. Nestle usually faces opposition, so they shop their plant around until they find a city that is gullible enough to let them take a huge quantity of their water practically for free. I'm sure that the towns that have managed to keep Nestle out have not seen other businesses flee the area.

heckasac 2009-10-27T23:15:24Z William Burg 2009-10-27T21:47:47Z 2009-10-27T21:47:47Z

Who needs rules when the person in charge of development tells developers that they don't have to follow them? That's the problem...these businesses were probably told that everything was fine by Bill Thomas and the Development Services department--now they are just as surprised when the house of cards starts to collapse.

William Burg 2009-10-27T21:47:47Z trapper 2009-10-27T19:31:58Z 2009-10-27T19:31:58Z

"The discussion about the new Nestle Waters bottling facility is actually about Sacramento’s commitment to job creation and the process and rules by which businesses come to our city." This first paragraph says it all, who needs rules when a mob can influence the final out come? Who needs more jobs and tax dollars more than this city? Business friendly this city is NOT!

trapper 2009-10-27T19:31:58Z